A bunch of useless crap
Published on March 31, 2007 By MasonM In Misc
I've been watching a series of programs on the History Channel about ancient Chinese technology. It's highly obvious that we modern people are not the original inventors of automatic machines, complex mass production factories, or even computers. The Chinese had all of these things more than 1,000 years ago. Truly incredible feats of science and engineering.

Some of the things that are impressive are like the semi-automatic repeating crossbow, flame throwers, rocket launchers, automatic trip hammers for mass production metal work, a grain mill that used a single large water wheel to drive a complex series of gears that turned not just one but nine grindstones, and automatic adding machines.

The most impressive of all was a very complex, five story tall water powered mechanical computer used to precisely measure time down to the second. It tracked the days, years, and seasons, as well as the positions of the stars, planets, and other celestial bodies. A truly incredible accomplishment.

They were also masters of metallurgy and had discovered how to make and use chromium 1,000 years before the West. Many of the swords that have been discovered buried in tombs over 1,000 years ago remain both razor sharp and shiny to this day thanks to their use of chromium to plate the blades.

The ancient Chinese used techniques and principles still used in modern machines and factories today, and they were doing it as much as 2,000 years ago. The West didn't start discovering and using most of these principles and techniques until the 18th and 19th centuries. Many of them, such as the use of chromium, weren't discovered by Western society until the middle of the 20th century.

One has to wonder what those brilliant ancient engineers could have accomplished had they discovered how to harness electricity.

Comments
on Mar 31, 2007
They also caused the downfall of the Roman empire through their own expansion and the subsequent domino-effect displacement of barbarian tribes.

It makes me wonder how far ahead they're going to be when their investments in science and technology education today start to pay off. How do we even have a hope of keeping up?
on Mar 31, 2007
Interesting. I sometimes wonder how many times things have had to be re-invented or truths re-discovered only due to the destruction of libraries during military conquest. Many, no doubt.
on Mar 31, 2007
It makes me wonder how far ahead they're going to be when their investments in science and technology education today start to pay off. How do we even have a hope of keeping up?


Their culture has changed so much over the past century or so, especially since the change to a Communist society, that in many ways they've actually gone backwards in comparison to their ancient ancestors.
on Mar 31, 2007

Interesting. I sometimes wonder how many times things have had to be re-invented or truths re-discovered only due to the destruction of libraries during military conquest. Many, no doubt.


I suspect that's the nature of things. Civilizations rise and fall, and their knowledge is lost until another rises and reinvents. If it weren't for the Irish hoarding and preserving so much literature after the fall of the Roman empire Western civilization would have been starting over again from scratch.
on Mar 31, 2007
Their culture has changed so much over the past century or so, especially since the change to a Communist society, that in many ways they've actually gone backwards in comparison to their ancient ancestors.


It won't and hasn't lasted. So many of their citizens are studying the sciences overseas that they'll catch up very soon on overseas developments, and having 1.2 billion people allows for an awful lot of geniuses to be born and exploited. They've already poached enough experts from overseas to become a rival to Germany on solar technologies, and their rocketry and computer technologies are increasingly sophisticated. Other areas are also improving, particularly telecomms, although that's largely through partnerships with European and American companies.

Combine that with a population that's much more pro-technology than anywhere in the western world and you have a huge potential for further growth.
on Mar 31, 2007
Combine that with a population that's much more pro-technology than anywhere in the western world and you have a huge potential for further growth.


I don't disagree at all, I just don't see them dominating technology in the way they did 1,000 years ago. Having such a huge population requires tremendous resource commitment to simply feed, house, and clothe them.
on Mar 31, 2007
I don't disagree at all, I just don't see them dominating technology in the way they did 1,000 years ago. Having such a huge population requires tremendous resource commitment to simply feed, house, and clothe them.


To some extent I agree, but private enterprise is growing rapidly in China and should be able to deliver those kinds of services without too much trouble. After all, China already clothes the world. Their food comes from some local agriculture but mostly from Canada, the US and Australia. Housing is just a matter of megacities, something a dictatorship doesn't have to have much trouble controlling (look at Singapore after all). Their current reliance on oil is a big problem, but their research into solar and other cheap technologies should do something to assuage that by the time their middle class reaches the upper end of the hundreds of millions.

And really it's the middle class that will drive any scientific success. The reason the US dominates so totally in research and development can be linked to its large, well-educated population. But with only a few hundred million people in total it just can't compare with a middle class China.

The US' only hope for maintaining indefinite world dominance really is to somehow stop or cripple economic growth in China, and I'm not sure how that could happen. Even if they can, India is still much, much larger than the US; how to control them as well considering their growing skill with high level biotech and IT?
on Mar 31, 2007
If they were so smart, then what's up with the chopsticks???? Gimme a knife and fork dammit....
on Apr 01, 2007

If they were so smart, then what's up with the chopsticks???? Gimme a knife and fork dammit....


I like using chopsticks.
on Apr 01, 2007
I like using chopsticks.


yeah, me too. And I can even play it on the P-naner too...
on Apr 01, 2007

I like using chopsticks.


yeah, me too. And I can even play it on the P-naner too...